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Carlos Velasco
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 August 2019
Location: Spain
Posts: 280
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| Posted: 15 November 2020 at 5:36am | IP Logged | 1
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The `socialism' that the fool from Alabama - and most Republicans, at least the conservative ones - is against is Social Security, Medicare, and other social programs that help people. ie, what they mean when they talk about reducing government.
In other words, if you're not well off or rich and able to pay to take care of yourself, you can fuck off and die.
---
I wonder what these people think about this:
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James Woodcock
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7605
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| Posted: 15 November 2020 at 9:04am | IP Logged | 2
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Wealth is a weird thing for me - because I argue with myself about the
ethics of it.
For example, a horrendous amount of UK land, upwards of 75% has
not changed hands for the past few hundred years..
3,000 people in the U.K. are responsible for 25% of the total UK tax
take.
That is an enormous amount of unelected power that is handed down
from generation to generation.
& what I mean by that is, by having such a grip on land & the county/s
income, they have the ability to influence the government on policy - do
this or I am off & taking my tax with me. We have seen the effects of
that a number of times.
But, I think people should have the right to earn money for their hard
work.
So I have no easy answer for this.
I know I lean far more to the left & believe that those of us who live
comfortable lives should look after those that need help, but I also think
checks & balances should be in place so that people get what they
need. Not what they want.
When I see people who do not work driving cars I can’t afford, with 60
inch TVs, I know something has gone wrong. But every attempt to
address the imbalance ends up hurting those in need more than solving
the problem of exploiting the loopholes.
Not an easy subject to solve, & also,not an easy subject to discuss a lot
of the time.
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6097
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| Posted: 15 November 2020 at 1:59pm | IP Logged | 3
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Neil: Fascism and actual socialism are of the same ideology, with minor differences.
**
Are you arguing that "Nordic Socialism" arose independently of "Actual Socialism"?
Because your articles point out that it didn't and that, "We did have a period in the 1970s and 1980s when we had something that resembled socialism"
So are you saying it arose out of "Fascism"?
Of course not. Because they are not remotely the same.
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6097
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| Posted: 15 November 2020 at 2:18pm | IP Logged | 4
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Was Adolf Hitler a socialist?
Adolf Hitler was not a socialist - Vox
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Rebecca Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018
Location: Canada
Posts: 4499
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| Posted: 15 November 2020 at 4:13pm | IP Logged | 5
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"Thank you for sharing that, Rebecca - both your family history as well as the historical perspective."
I don't like to go into things too much as there is a lot of not so flattering stuff, but essentially my great uncle was targeted explicitly as a socialist by the Nazis. It may actually have led to anti-union and anti-socialism feelings among surviving family. I'm fairly wary of extremes of any kind, so any 'socialism is evil' or 'socialism solves all problems' I wouldn't be buying. I do find communism promises much and objectively has delivered death of body and spirit on large scales as close to evil as worth the label. This wouldn't mean I would see the people buying into it as evil though, but once bought there is no exchanging and they get trapped for generations.
This Nazis were socialists talking point seemed to really get taken up by the neo-con revolutionaries and libertarians of a couple decades ago. Having watched and been involved in some arguments going back to the '90s I would say they are still pretty deliberate in misunderstanding many things based on something written somewhere... kind of up to the present where some would 'prove' some grandiose fable of voter fraud in one state based on a single typo on some CNN post that was corrected quickly! it's removal even 'proving' a cover-up of course. This is a kind of mental illness really. You can't even call it political as what they stand for or believe in is as about as transactional as with Trump, so much is a means to an end.
People in occupied Europe risked their lives to keep radios to tune in to Radio Oranje and the BBC. They knew what the collaborationist 'state' might provide would be sheer propaganda blaming everyone but those who started things up again in righteous anger and dreams of nationalist glory. Rush Limbaugh and others like him are modern Lord Haw-Haws. It's typical of their misuse of words, destroying their meaning, that Bill O'Reilly's shows on Fox were subtitled 'no spin zones' when that's pretty much all they and his books were.
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6097
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| Posted: 15 November 2020 at 4:34pm | IP Logged | 6
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Rebecca, I feel compelled to acknowledge you for sharing your family story and insight son this too -- thank you.
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James Woodcock
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7605
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| Posted: 15 November 2020 at 5:24pm | IP Logged | 7
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Likewise Rebecca - very insightful
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Charles Valderrama
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4721
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| Posted: 17 November 2020 at 6:34pm | IP Logged | 8
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"Nearly a quarter million Americans dead, and Trump has almost totally abdicated his coronavirus responsibilities."
Also, Trump has fired a top security official who vouched for the 2020 election as he continues to push unsubstantiated claims of fraud after his loss.
These couple of months are gonna be insane. *sigh*
-C!
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Eric Ladd
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 August 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 4506
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| Posted: 19 November 2020 at 6:21am | IP Logged | 9
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An American dies every minute of the day now from a Covid-19. It is another terrible milestone for the US regarding this pandemic.
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Neil Lindholm
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: China
Posts: 4940
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| Posted: 19 November 2020 at 6:34am | IP Logged | 10
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Fascism and socialism and communism all have the same foundation, which is collectivism. The idea that the group is more important than the individual. The differences are just in degrees.
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Phil Kreisel
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Joined: 03 February 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 1911
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| Posted: 19 November 2020 at 10:37am | IP Logged | 11
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Maybe the topic name of this thread should be changed to Acting Non-Presidential. Just sayin'.
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Carlos Velasco
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 August 2019
Location: Spain
Posts: 280
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| Posted: 19 November 2020 at 2:46pm | IP Logged | 12
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Giuliani's surreal conference and the hair dye drops mixed with sweat has made the news in Spain.
I hope all these lies can help some conservative people reconsider their voting choices in future elections (or motivate people who don't usually vote to do it, if only out of fear for these maniacs).
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