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Jason Ayer
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 29 March 2008
Posts: 110
Posted: 12 February 2018 at 11:57am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

I posted this article in a facebook group and postulated that it was one more step in the changing landscape of comics. I feel that the time of
the monthly printed book has just about run its course. The reason print in general has resisted change is that up until now, there hasn’t been
a viable format alternative.

Music formats have changed several times in my lifetime alone. Every time there’s a change in format (LPs and 8-tracks to cassettes to CDs to
downloads to streaming) it seems to be pushed forward primarily by the younger generation over the objections of the older. The argument of
“We’re older and have the most money to spend so they have to listen to us” doesn’t seem to carry a lot of weight. Now, with CDs on the decline
and, presumably, on the way out, that argument is again being tossed about and, again, being ignored.

When I posted in the group, I got the same argument from a number of the older member, who, coincidentally enough, were all men over 30. But
according to these statistics (A Demographic Snapshot of Comic Buyers), if I’m reading them correctly, the ‘men over 30’ group, the group that frequent the LCSs
the most and buys most of the monthly ‘floppies’, are in the minority, comprising only ~30% of the comic buying public.

In the last year, 4 of the 6 LSCs in my area closed. I’m friends with the owner of one of the remaining two, and he told me that not only did
those closures not see an increase in his monthly subscriptions, but, in his store, more people are gravitating towards trades. Additionally,
more people are coming in for the experience. They not only want to buy comics, they want to talk about them (and movies and TV shows) something
they can’t do at Books-a-Million. (On another note, over the last few years, the nine books stores within a comfortable driving distance from me
have decreased to two, with one large used bookstore.)

Marvel and DC are already dipping their toes in the ‘digital issues to be printed later as a trade’ waters. I’m wondering how long before they
decide to go there completely, with possibly only the barest of monthlies, or maybe quarterlies, on the shelves?

What do you think? Please note I’m not saying I prefer one over the other. I’m simply trying to look at things academically.

Edited by Jason Ayer on 12 February 2018 at 11:59am
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John Byrne

Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132134
Posted: 12 February 2018 at 12:07pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

From the article:

• 72% of purchases in comic shops are by men, with 30-50 year olds the largest age category;

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Jason Ayer
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 29 March 2008
Posts: 110
Posted: 12 February 2018 at 12:49pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

From the article:
• 72% of purchases in comic shops are by men, with 30-
50 year olds the largest age category;
___________________________________________

True, but the article says that comic buyers overall
(LSC, bookstores, and online) are 63% men, with half
of those being under 30. That leaves the over 30 male
category at around ~30%. That 30% are the primary
customers of the LCS.

Again, I could be extrapolating the data wrong, but
that’s how I was reading it.
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John Byrne

Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132134
Posted: 12 February 2018 at 1:08pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

The 30 to 50 group is the largest part of the 72% group. Half of 72% would be 36%, so the 30/50 group must represent more than that, to be the largest part.
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John Jackson Miller
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 10 February 2018
Location: United States
Posts: 2
Posted: 12 February 2018 at 4:39pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

I've been cautious about considering the periodical format as being in decline -- in part because the numbers simply hadn't shown it. Periodical sales (in units, not dollars) were up six of the last seven years, and twelve of the last sixteen. We're just getting there in a different manner, involving lower sales but from a lot more publishers and books.

I also think it's easy to overlook the aftermarket, which adds several hundred million dollars to the business annually and is almost exclusively based on periodicals. Most of that volume doesn't depend on a steady stream of new periodicals, but I think it helps to keep the category in people's minds. The collectible trade in casino tokens and stock certificates tended to dwindle after new ones stopped being made.
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Brian Floyd
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 07 July 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 8322
Posted: 13 February 2018 at 3:29pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Newspapers are also on their last legs, and print magazines will be heading that way eventually. So Clark Kent better go back to tv, and I guess Peter Parker is going to have to find some place else to take photos for.
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Brian Hague
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 14 November 2006
Posts: 8515
Posted: 13 February 2018 at 6:51pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Do former heads of international technology corporations take photos for others? 

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Greg Kirkman
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 12 May 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 15775
Posted: 13 February 2018 at 7:08pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Do former heads of international technology corporations take photos for others?
+++++++++++

Only as a fallback career, apparently.
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Joe Boster
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3160
Posted: 14 February 2018 at 9:02pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

newspapers are on the decline, but there is bright spots such as locally owned weekly newspapers. NYT makessomething like 70% of it's revenue from the paywall. Some have found success as Non-profit organizations. 

last year was bad for comics, and was a overdue correction. The over 30 voted with thier wallet and publishers took notice. The only issue with beadth and not depth in sales is it's really hard for a store to order shelf copies which you need to get new blood. 

I opined that  month comic books are like Vinyl. Which is limited lack of manufacturing from even more growth. and not going away any time soon. And if a publisher can be profitable at diamond's minimum purhcase of 1500 then anything is possible. 
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Robbie Parry
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 17 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 12186
Posted: 15 February 2018 at 5:11am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

I bought SIDEWAYS #1 yesterday.

It was mildly enjoyable, but, as is so often the case with modern comics, telling a very small part of what will no doubt be a six-part tale.

This "decompression" is beginning to irk me.

I WANT to support comics. I do with our host (who doesn't do decompression and makes every issue of a title accessible and enjoyable). 

But look at it from my perspective: I want to support the character/concept of SIDEWAYS. I want to ensure its longevity. But nearly four quid (from Forbidden Planet) for an issue in which hardly anything happens is a BIG ask. Why wouldn't I wait for the trade?

I get it, I really do. If we all do that, the monthly book will cease to exist. I want pennies for the SIDEWAYS creators NOW! But it feels so incomplete. 

I bought ELEMENTARY on DVD recently. An entire season. I have to because I don't get it on TV here. But would I have bought 1-2 episodes at a time on a solo disc? No. Who would? I'm bound to "wait for the trade" with such a thing, not that DVD companies do that, anyway.

One of my favourite comics from our host is SUPERMAN VOL. 2 #9, where Superman fights Joker. Published in 1987. 40 pence, I think. A complete tale which took a little while to read (plus a letters page!). 

Yes, prices increase (that's life), but I don't see nearly four quid good for an incomplete tale. Sorry. I want to support the industry. But when I reached the end of SIDEWAYS, which took less than 8-10 minutes to read, it felt so very incomplete. 

I hope I'm making sense. I have no issue with supporting a comic. If the aforementioned SUPERMAN VOL. 2 #9 was released today, I think nearly four quid for that tale would be a bargain! Four quid for a tale that can take 20-25 minutes to read, plus with a letters page. 

It's the incompleteness (if that's a word) that no longer provides an incentive. I do understand only by buying the monthly book can SIDEWAYS be viable. And I'm not greedy, but "warm-up" issues no longer work for me.

I should add that I pay nearly four quid for SCOOBY-DOO TEAM-UP. And just to prove I'm not averse to spending cash, I think that's a bargain. Most issues have a complete tale. Even two-parters (I think there may have been some) work well. I feel like I get "bang for my buck". I didn't feel that way about SIDEWAYS.
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Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 31 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 4789
Posted: 15 February 2018 at 11:41am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

RP: "Why wouldn't I wait for the trade?"

Just that you can ask this question is a red flag. The fact it represents - that comics are now being published in six issues as chapters - is a reason to AVOID buying comics. It's a resale market... and how can a book be resold when its sales were terrible in the first place?

It's another sign that publishers are burning their crops to stay warm... it works in the extreme short term, but it is eliminating their tomorrow. And today, they're getting hungry, I think.
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Robbie Parry
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 17 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 12186
Posted: 15 February 2018 at 12:07pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Thanks for understanding, Eric. Some I speak to on Facebook don't.

You know, I read some of Tom King's Batman books. Yes, written for the trade, but plenty of action in each comic. But I will not buy a single issue of talking heads, build-up and exposition. That's lunacy.

No-one else would do that with other forms of entertainment: "We'll release a chapter of Stephen King's short stories, for one or two quid, over six months. Eight months later, the complete short story will be available." No way!

Our host has done arcs over his career, but each issue provided bang for buck! SIDEWAYS did not. The villain (or opponent) appeared in the last panel, the rest was build-up. If it is a six-issue arc, I'd rather wait for the trade.
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