Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login
Dr. Who MOBILE
Byrne Robotics | Dr. Who << Prev Page of 4 Next >>
Topic: Rosa (S11, E3) Post Reply | Post New Topic
Author
Message
Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12989
Posted: 23 October 2018 at 12:38pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

On an unrelated note - I'm surprised that three episodes 
in (where the characters now all know they're in a time 
machine) and no one has demanded they go back and rescue 
'Nan' from episode 1.

------

Considering that the companions only discover that the Doctor has a time machine at the end of episode 2 and they have their first adventure in the past while attempting to get home at the beginning of episode 3, there really wasn't much time for that conversation. Either the Doctor has already explained things off-screen or the full ramifications of being in a time machine hadn't sunken in yet.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Steve De Young
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 01 April 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 3315
Posted: 23 October 2018 at 4:48pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

On an unrelated note - I'm surprised that three episodes
in (where the characters now all know they're in a time
machine) and no one has demanded they go back and rescue
'Nan' from episode 1. 
-----------------------------------------
Also, since the Doctor has been thus far unable to get them back to their own place and time, why would they think she could aim the TARDIS precisely enough to get there at the moment they would need to to save her?
Back to Top profile | search
 
Jim Muir
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 26 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 1243
Posted: 24 October 2018 at 1:50am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

You're all right, of course.
Though If I had just lost a close member of my family and
discovered someone with a time machine, I'm pretty sure
it would be the Very First Thing I asked!

Back to Top profile | search
 
Robbie Parry
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 17 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 12187
Posted: 24 October 2018 at 5:20am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Of course, Jim, the First Doctor said it, but when has any incarnation of the Doctor followed the rules? ;-)
Back to Top profile | search
 
Craig Bogart
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 18 June 2008
Posts: 407
Posted: 26 October 2018 at 2:05pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

"On an unrelated note - I'm surprised that three episodes 
in (where the characters now all know they're in a time 
machine) and no one has demanded they go back and rescue 
'Nan' from episode 1."

We've already been there with "Father's Day".
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Matthew Wilkie
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 09 March 2011
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 1112
Posted: 26 October 2018 at 2:24pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Considering that the companions only discover that the Doctor has a time machine at the end of episode 2 and they have their first adventure in the past while attempting to get home at the beginning of episode 3, there really wasn't much time for that conversation. 

***

I'm working from memory, but I think that it was stated that they had actually gone to a number of locations between episodes 2 and 3.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12989
Posted: 26 October 2018 at 2:39pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

I'm working from memory, but I think that it was stated that they had actually gone to a number of locations between episodes 2 and 3.


They had made several failed attempts to arrive in 2018 Sheffield, but the impression that I had was they never went exploring. The Doctor only left the TARDIS that time to investigate the artron energy. 
Back to Top profile | search
 
Jason Scott
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 06 August 2012
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 898
Posted: 28 October 2018 at 12:49pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

This was the first episode of the new season that actually felt any good to me. (Maybe because as Greg has said it was very reminiscent of Quantum leap.)
Some very nice production values as well. Shooting it abroad really helped get away from looking like Cardiff again.

Sadly tonight's is a return to ho-hum Sheffield. And Spiders! So can't say I'm looking forward to it.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Andy Mokler
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 20 January 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 2661
Posted: 29 October 2018 at 1:32am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

1955 is a little before my time but apparently all white people were violent and deranged back then.  This episode makes Mississippi Burning look like Sesame Street.

Would an ignorant racist waitress from Alabama assume Yasmin was Mexican?  I know it was meant to be hilarious but that took me right out of the episode and got me wondering.  From the quick Googling I did, the Hispanic population of Alabama in 1970 was about .5%.  15-20 earlier it was probably less.

It seems to me that it's a "joke" that modern viewers would get but one that doesn't necessarily make any historical sense.

Definitely felt more like Quantum Leap than Doctor Who.  It seems they were trying to somewhat accurately portray the history of Rosa Parks but that becomes a dangerous retelling when every white person of the era is portrayed as a propaganda level of racism and hate.  

I suppose it's also common for the Tardis to land the Doctor in situations that weren't expected or planned but I don't recall the Doctor continually not being able to get back to a particular time when the Tardis was working properly.  I admit, I may be forgetting but it seems like the modern Doctor pops in and out of time and space with relative accuracy.

In which case, I'd have preferred if the Doctor had noticed the energy particles in the time stream and purposely detoured in 1955 to investigate.  They were on the way to 2018 but it was too important and getting home had to wait.

That would possibly create some tension from the companions and perhaps leave the audience wondering if the Doctor was just doing it as an excuse to keep his new playmates around.

I have definitely not warmed up to this new group at all and none of it has felt like Doctor Who but I kind of enjoyed episode 2.  Especially compared to 1 and 3.  I've read that the ratings are down to 6+ million from the 8+ million premiere so I don't know if it's going to be a steady decline or if it's just finding it's leveling off point.  Apparently the show is ranking higher than previous seasons of Who but I don't know what that means in actual viewers.  A 25% drop in 2 weeks sounds like a lot but that may be normal for all I know.
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12989
Posted: 29 October 2018 at 6:23am | IP Logged | 10 post reply


 QUOTE:
1955 is a little before my time but apparently all white people were violent and deranged back then.  This episode makes Mississippi Burning look like Sesame Street.

Hardly. It did, however, depict an environment where Emmett Till could be murdered and have people defending the killers even after they confessed, where non-violent protestors sitting at a lunch counter could be dragged out of their seats and beaten, where mobs of white people wielding baseball bats and iron pipes could beat a group of people just riding a bus together and get away with it....


 QUOTE:
Would an ignorant racist waitress from Alabama assume Yasmin was Mexican?  I know it was meant to be hilarious but that took me right out of the episode and got me wondering.  From the quick Googling I did, the Hispanic population of Alabama in 1970 was about .5%.  15-20 earlier it was probably less.

It seems to me that it's a "joke" that modern viewers would get but one that doesn't necessarily make any historical sense.

Anti-Mexican sentiment is not a modern phenomenon. "Operation Wetback", the mass deportation of Mexican nationals in the US took place in 1954. Also, the bracero guest worker program that brought Mexicans into the country to work in agriculture included Arkansas and Mississippi as participants. So it's not that far-fetched that a waitress in Alabama would see a brown person and assume Mexican. What other ethnicity would she assume?



Edited by Michael Roberts on 29 October 2018 at 6:26am
Back to Top profile | search
 
Andy Mokler
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 20 January 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 2661
Posted: 29 October 2018 at 12:03pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

 Michael Roberts wrote:
Hardly. It did, however, depict an environment where Emmett Till could be murdered and have people defending the killers even after they confessed, where non-violent protestors sitting at a lunch counter could be dragged out of their seats and beaten, where mobs of white people wielding baseball bats and iron pipes could beat a group of people just riding a bus together and get away with it....

I think the episode is assuming too much.  It is assuming that the viewer knows that there were "some" white people who weren't hateful, racist, violent people in Alabama but it portrays "all" white people(from that era) as such.  It's inconsistent too. The one man strikes Ryan who is being polite and respectful but does nothing to Parks when she gets in the way and interrupts him.

Now that I think about it, everyone Ryan encounters treats him poorly but it's a mixed reaction with Parks.  The bus driver screams at her but others treat her a little less maniacally.  The police that take her off the bus are downright patient and gentle.  

I just think a more balanced depiction of that era would have been just as jarring to people from 65 years in the future.  A more realistic depiction that showed some white people were sympathetic but conflicted would have been just as dramatic and not taken away from the story.
 Michael Roberts wrote:
Anti-Mexican sentiment is not a modern phenomenon. "Operation Wetback", the mass deportation of Mexican nationals in the US took place in 1954. Also, the bracero guest worker program that brought Mexicans into the country to work in agriculture included Arkansas and Mississippi as participants. So it's not that far-fetched that a waitress in Alabama would see a brown person and assume Mexican. What other ethnicity would she assume?
Persian?  Or asking?  "What are you?" would be just as insulting but less "humorous".  Probably the most realistic response if you think about it.  But that wasn't the message.  I don't really know how Alabamans felt about Mexicans but the deportation event you suggested was initiated by the Mexican government, wasn't it?

I don't know.  The episode just paints "all" white people a certain way and in a story that's supposed to be about understanding and tolerance, it's either ironic or agenda driven.  
Back to Top profile | search e-mail
 
Steve De Young
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 01 April 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 3315
Posted: 29 October 2018 at 1:09pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

The episode just paints "all" white people a certain way and in a story that's supposed to be about understanding and tolerance, it's either ironic or agenda driven.  
-------------------------------------------------
All white people in Alabama in the 1950's.  If there had been an SJW there, that would have upset me considerably more.  A couple years ago on NPR, they read out some of the letters that housewives in the deep south sent to Truman when the US military was desegregated.  Stuff that would make a Klansman blush.  From the southern equivalent of Donna Reed.  The only reason Parks got different treatment is that they knew her in the community.  Ryan was a stranger.

I get that we don't want to believe that people that close to our own time could have been that horrible.  But they were.  That's historical reality.  There were enlightened people, usually young idealists, in that time who came down south to help the struggle.  Many of them were murdered for it.  There were probably people of similar sympathies in Alabama in the 1950's.  But they were cowards, who didn't dare say anything publicly for fear of the repercussions.  If you want to say that moral cowards who allow racism to happen are morally superior to the racists themselves somehow...okay...but its shades of evil.
Back to Top profile | search
 

<< Prev Page of 4 Next >>
  Post Reply | Post New Topic |

Forum Jump

 Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login

You are currently viewing the MOBILE version of the site.
CLICK HERE TO VIEW THE FULL SITE