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Scott Barnett
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 14 December 2018
Location: United States
Posts: 254
Posted: 22 August 2019 at 5:33am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Thank you for coming to my defense, Matt, but honestly, I don't see the problem here.

Tim, I confess to not understanding why you think posting the original pages inked is somehow offensive. I inked these pages several months ago, when that's all there was of this project, but even so, I don't see the problem if I had inked these yesterday.

I don't recall JB requesting we not post the original 20-page story inked. If he has, I'll abide by whatever rules he's set up. These are his pages and this is his playground.
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John Byrne

Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132135
Posted: 22 August 2019 at 8:03am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

A general note: A lot of you, inking the jungle backgrounds in the first "issue," are using a very dead line. No variation. This makes the backgrounds look like wallpaper, rather than real, living jungle.

Look closely. Notice how I rotate my pencil to give variation in each line, thick/thin, thin/think.

A little more BOUNCE to the line!

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Paul Wills
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 18 August 2018
Location: United States
Posts: 833
Posted: 22 August 2019 at 1:32pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

I'm currently working on a page with jungle background. I can't wait to put this tip to use! (somehow I keep picking the pages to ink involving the nightmare Wolverine).
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Jeffrey Rice
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 10 September 2011
Location: United States
Posts: 1161
Posted: 22 August 2019 at 4:07pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Would using a traditional brush help to learn line variation?
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Tim O Neill
Byrne Robotics Security


Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10918
Posted: 22 August 2019 at 6:50pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply


Scott B: "Thank you for coming to my defense, Matt, but honestly, I don't see
the problem here.

Tim, I confess to not understanding why you think posting the original pages
inked is somehow offensive. I inked these pages several months ago, when
that's all there was of this project, but even so, I don't see the problem if I had
inked these yesterday.

I don't recall JB requesting we not post the original 20-page story inked. If he
has, I'll abide by whatever rules he's set up. These are his pages and this is his
playground."

"****

Well, I didn't say it was offensive and I didn't say it was restricted - of course
you can post those pages. I was giving my opinion that there were several
pages with no dialogue, and I am more talking about the blue line pages.
When Eric offered blue lines by email I thought I would mention that I didn't like
seeing the dialogue/narration not inked. If more people will be inking on blue
line, I would hope they retain the dialogue, which is the only thing on the
original that is inked. To evaluate these pages, I think it's best to see to the full
piece, and the dialogue is important - I don't think the dialogue should be
given short shrift.


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Scott Barnett
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 14 December 2018
Location: United States
Posts: 254
Posted: 23 August 2019 at 10:38am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Well, I didn't say it was offensive and I didn't say it was restricted - of course 
you can post those pages. I was giving my opinion that there were several 
pages with no dialogue, and I am more talking about the blue line pages. 
When Eric offered blue lines by email I thought I would mention that I didn't like 
seeing the dialogue/narration not inked. If more people will be inking on blue 
line, I would hope they retain the dialogue, which is the only thing on the 
original that is inked. To evaluate these pages, I think it's best to see to the full 
piece, and the dialogue is important - I don't think the dialogue should be 
given short shrift.

-------------------------

Your initial post sounded to me as though you thought I was doing something disrespectful.

In any event, I had created my bluelines from the content I had available to me at the time, which was the unlettered 20-page story from last summer. That's what is printed on artboards in my studio. I'd rather not waste that time and those art supplies, so when I get back to it, I'll be finishing that version first.

I'd love to start inking the lettered versions, too, but all in good time.
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Scott Barnett
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 14 December 2018
Location: United States
Posts: 254
Posted: 23 August 2019 at 10:41am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

A general note: A lot of you, inking the jungle backgrounds in the first "issue," are using a very dead line. No variation. This makes the backgrounds look like wallpaper, rather than real, living jungle.

Look closely. Notice how I rotate my pencil to give variation in each line, thick/thin, thin/think.

A little more BOUNCE to the line!

-------------

Thank you for the tip, JB! That was another unintended consequence to shrinking down my inks to post here (I lost a fair amount of the line variation I thought I had achieved).

Lesson learned!

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Eric Ladd
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 16 August 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 4506
Posted: 23 August 2019 at 11:28am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

 Tim O Neill wrote:
dismissive of the full piece

The spirit of this thread is definitely to allow people to stretch out artistically. Respect for the subject matter is implied and I thought I was being respectful by putting my work out there as well as trying to help others. I don't know how I am being "dismissive" by only inking the pages and doing some of the lettering duty. I don't think it is dismissive when Darren Taylor, Mark McKay or anyone else posts a portion of a page and I'm not sure why I would be singled out when I post a portion of a page. There is nothing dismissive or disrespectful intended when I post pages that are fulling inked, but partially lettered. Back on page 6 of this thread I did post a page with lettering and it took a very long time to get right. Since I have no intention of being a letterer I would rather spend that time inking images and practicing with a brush and quill.
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Tim O Neill
Byrne Robotics Security


Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10918
Posted: 24 August 2019 at 2:13pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply


I just don't agree with anything you are saying here, Eric. I think we're coming
from different places. This is a thread for people to post their work, and
people are sharing opinions pretty freely - I don't know why my opinion is
getting this kind of resistance.

I don't think this is a great thread for debate, but I will say one thing to back up
a bit and give some context:

I see JB as a kind of pioneer in lettering. He was the first I was aware of who
took control of his lettering and used a computer early in his career. And
because I prefer when he writes his own work, I like seeing how the dialogue
interacts with the art.

One of my favorite aspects of ELSEWHEN is that while the pencils will be
interpreted by many inkers, the dialogue/narration is baked into the piece and
complete. You don't need to ink it - it's done and it's a major part of the
piece.You don't have any "duty" as a letterer, but you are removing what is
there. I see a lot of rookie and professional inkers do things to JB's art I
disagree with, but I didn't think we would see the dialogue drop out like this, so
I am saying something.

I'm no artist, but since the dialogue/narration is camera ready, can't you paste
it up or digitally add it? Wouldn't you just need to ink the balloon? It just
seems what you are doing is wrong.


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Peter Martin
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 17 March 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 15729
Posted: 24 August 2019 at 7:41pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

So you don't see it as offensive, merely wrong? A rose by any other name...

JB is a wonderful storyteller. I doubt there are many (if any) on this board who don't admire his writing. But, for goodness sake, this is a thread about inking his art. You may prefer the words in place, but to say that to post art without the words is wrong is simply going too far, Tim.
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Doug Centers
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 17 February 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 5438
Posted: 24 August 2019 at 8:21pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Now that I have blue lines (thanks Eric), I'll be inking the balloons but they'll be empty.
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Eric Ladd
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 16 August 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 4506
Posted: 25 August 2019 at 3:39pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Tim, take a look at the history of my posts and you will see a variety of attempts while I wrestled with the dialog on pages when posting a page. I've tried printing my blue line boards with the boarders, balloons and dialog in black to save a step, but the "customer use" copiers can't print well on smooth bristol boards and those elements get scraped off by a straight edge eventually. I've tried everything and the only way I can get the dialog on the page is to digitally add it and that is as I mentioned too time consuming. Since posting my pages without the dialog might offend I will simply post potions that are not complete for comment. So let's get back to putting up some art.

I am liking how the Prototype Sentinel is coming out on this page:


This panel is a lot of fun. This is the fourth time I have inked it:


And, I do like the effects on this panel and I am salivating to do page 15 of issue #3. This is also my fourth time:


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