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Greg McPhee
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Joined: 25 August 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 4312
Posted: 21 March 2020 at 10:02am | IP Logged | 1 post reply


Agreed about the first part and Englehart says it was DeFalco related, but I thought #25-31 turned it around nicely. (Per Englehart, he was given permission to do what he wanted as long as he left when it was over.) 

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Dave, I'll check them out again. I just thought that Silver Surfer went the way of WCA and FF. If he was given a chance to finish as per what he wanted that is a bit strange compared to the other two titles. 
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Craig Earl
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Joined: 13 July 2019
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Posted: 21 March 2020 at 10:21am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

I recently realized that my knowledge of the Amazing Spider-Man between 50 and 100 (Stan Lee & John Romita sr.) is lacking. Less of a rediscovery and more of a new discovery. I have started this one. 

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That's a great run. I invested heavily in the Marvel Essentials range a few years back, so have decades of the main titles covered (including the run you mention here). Reading the odd review online, I think some people were put off by the B&W format but it didn't bother me.
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Dave Phelps
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Joined: 16 April 2004
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Posted: 21 March 2020 at 12:53pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Not sure I'd call them "back issues" in the same spirit as the original question but a number of long running (and not so long running) series have ended recently and I'm re-reading them as complete sets. Just wrapped up The Walking Dead (those Compendia get heavy) and Outpost Zero. Next up is likely going to be The Wicked and the Divine. Also have League of Extraordinary Gentlemen, Priest Deathstroke and the Ditko 32 Page series on deck. Likely some others I'm forgetting.    

Other than that, will definitely be digging out the DeFalco/Trimp/Windsor-Smith Machine Man mini-series. Just seems fitting for some reason. :-) Currently deciding whether to just pull that out or to go for the whole 2001/original Machine Man series/various guest-appearances/mini-series run.
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Shawn Kane
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Joined: 04 November 2010
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Posted: 22 March 2020 at 5:48am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Greg,
I agree with you about the Avengers going downhill around 375. I don't love that run but the Epting/Palmer team makes it readable. If I'm being honest, the Avengers was never the same for me after Roger Stern left.

I find when I do the big re-reads, I really figure out which runs really matter to me. The X-Men became harder to read once JRjr. left and it's my all-time favorite book. Captain America is my favorite character and I've often recommended the Gruenwald run to friends as an example of my favorite run with the character but it's really uneven on a re-read. The Fantastic Four never really recovered for me after JB left even though the names Stern, Buscema, and Simonson had runs. It's fascinating to me to realize that many comics that I enjoyed as a monthly comic book reader as a kid now feel like I'm going through the motions on re-reads.
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Greg McPhee
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Joined: 25 August 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 4312
Posted: 22 March 2020 at 7:50am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Shawn,

The Avengers never really got over the firing of Roger Stern. Not that there weren't talented people who followed, it just seemed to lose its way until Busiek and Perex came along.

The Fantastic Four (original series) has these 3 stand-out runs:

  • Lee / Kirby
  • Byrne
  • Simonson
Everything else is just to uneven or doesn't get the dynamics right. It's weird as a lot of writers Thomas, Conway, Wein, Wolfman, Moench, Englehart and DeFalco never seemed to be able to get things right.

Englehart and DeFalco stunningly missing the mark with their runs.
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Shawn Kane
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Joined: 04 November 2010
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Posted: 22 March 2020 at 12:13pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

I remember reading Englehart's run and wondering when things were going to go back to normal. Pine Cone Thing, She-Thing, Human Torch, and Crystal just didn't seem like the FF to me. And to find out later on that Englehart had zero interest in bringing back Reed and Sue really drove it home how in-Fantastic Four that run felt to me. Even though I enjoyed She-Hulk on the team, I felt Ben would eventually return. But to change the line-up again so soon after having him re-join just didn't work.

Marvel has done the same thing with Captain America recently. How many times does Steve Rogers need to lose the costume?
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Greg McPhee
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Joined: 25 August 2004
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Posted: 22 March 2020 at 12:54pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

I really had no idea where Englehart was going with his run. He stated that it had had periods of greatness but was floundering when Marvel asked him to revive it. Bit contradictory as he took over with issue 304, and JB left with 293 (plotted 294 - 295), and Roger Stern was no slouch when he stepped in from  294 onwards.

From his own website he says this was his goal with the FF:

"The FF was always the "real life" adventures of superheroes, but as the series atrophied many people forgot about the real life part; growth and change went out the window. I identified the hermetically-sealed group of Reed & Sue & Ben & Johnny as a main reason the book has grown stale - and Reed & Sue had been saying for years that they should pay more attention to their perpetually 6-year-old son Franklin - so I let 'em."

Therein lies the problem. Not being able to write in the parameters set.
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Peter Hicks
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Joined: 30 April 2004
Location: Canada
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Posted: 22 March 2020 at 7:03pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

You have me intrigued.  What issue numbers was Marshall Rogers on Silver Surfer?
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Jason G. Michalski
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Joined: 03 June 2019
Location: United States
Posts: 87
Posted: 23 March 2020 at 11:57am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

I found myself reading the Simonson/Liefeld run on New Mutants via the Marvel Universe app. It was fun revisiting those issues after 30 years. 

Other things I plan on re-reading/finishing:

Snyder/Capullo Batman 
Tom King's Batman 
Ironman 2020 TPB from the 80s


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Daniel Gillotte
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Joined: 11 October 2005
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Posts: 2003
Posted: 23 March 2020 at 12:27pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

A friend and his brother have a podcast that may interest some of you and give you "homework". They have done podcasts going through classic runs:
Ditko and Lee on the first 38 issues of Spider-Man
Kirby and Lee on their entire FF run
Kirby, Lee and (yes, Ditko) on the initial short-lived Incredible Hulk run.

The show is fun and I have enjoyed reading these older issues and listening in... Screw it, we're just gonna talk about comics
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Craig Earl
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Joined: 13 July 2019
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 172
Posted: 23 March 2020 at 1:29pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

You have me intrigued.  What issue numbers was Marshall Rogers on Silver Surfer?

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Peter,

Rogers covered the first ten issues of volume 3 and then the occasional issue after that. I got on board at the time and kind of enjoyed it but when Starlin and Lim took the reins it reached a whole new level (IMO)
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Colin Ian Campbell
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Joined: 24 April 2015
Location: England
Posts: 117
Posted: 23 March 2020 at 2:48pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Issue 21 is an Englehart / Rogers one-off involving the Elders of the Universe.
***
Silver Surfer #21 was a fill-in co-plotted by Marshall Rogers and Michael Higgins and scripted  by the latter.
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