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Geoffrey Langford
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 20 December 2013
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 235
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 6:13am | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Just catching up a bit here.

ID is not required in Nevada.  I'm sure there are other supposed safeguards in effect - however, the point isn't that someone can show a million people drove to Nevada and voted fraudulently - but the mere fact ONE person could do it DOES show a flaw in the security of the voting process.  For the people to have faith in the process, it needs to be more foolproof than driving a few hours east and voting again.

If instances of fraud are not fully and completely investigated - how can we ever trust the system? 

Voting electronically using a software system shown to be corrupted in Venezuela ???  C'mon!!!  That's the best software available??!!

There's a laundry list of irregularities and problems.  There always is.

There shouldn't be.

This election needs to be audited and investigated, completely.  Every single vote cast, every data bit transmitted -- no matter what the price tag.   It needs to be done for the welfare of the American voters, so they can be assured the system did not fail them.  Not to try and undo a Biden win -- simply to show the process worked.

Donald Trump barely lost, but he lost.  Joe Biden (and in a few months Kamala Harris) will be president.  The new administration needs to fund the audit of this election and it needs to be a priority.  Groups and individuals found to have cheated need to be held accountable PUBLICLY to the fullest extent of the law.

The problem here is -- The democrats don't want an audit.  They have a win.  Why ask for the instant replay on Monday morning after you've won the super bowl? 

I say audit -- because the integrity of one of the most basic and fundamental foundations of American democracy is at risk.

Oh -- and DAN CRENSHAW 2024 !!!!


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Peter Martin
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 17 March 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 15726
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 8:02am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

John Wickett: So on election day, if all the poll worker did was report to her supervisor (who allegedly said there was nothing they could do), then now it would be very difficult to prove, because you can't identify the questionable ballots.
-----------------------------------------
This requires the unlikely sequence of the hypothetical ballot harvester doing the fraud in plain sight and the poll worker then choosing to do nothing. 

As I said, if this was seen, it's an egregious act. An extremely serious breach of the law. Seems bizarre that a poll worker sees it, then chooses to let the rogue ballots get dumped in with everything else. Then later on decided -- when nothing can be proved -- to report it.

All so unlikely, in fact, that I discount it as unfeasible, in the absense of some actual proof.
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Peter Martin
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Joined: 17 March 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 15726
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 8:15am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Geoff, where was the same energy for a full audit when the intelligence community was saying Russia interfered in the 2016 election (and which was won by a smaller margin?).


The election process did work. Any damage in the confidence of the integrity of the election is a result not of atypical malfeasance but of unfounded propaganda from the Trump camp. CISA warned that the biggest risk was someone taking advantage of misunderstandings about the security measures and exaggerating issue or putting out false rumours/ unverified information. They seemed to be warning that this might be done by some foreign agent... But it turns out the doofus doing it the most was the sitting President.

We know this, because he went on TV and said the blatant lie that he won. We know this because he tried to take advantage of the intrinsically delayed nature of the vote counting this time by claiming he'd won when an unrepresentative proportion of the votes had been counted. We know this because he asked for the vote count to be stopped when he thought it suited him.
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Brad Wilders
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 15 December 2008
Posts: 173
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 8:51am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

"Unfortunately, all of the articles I've seen are vague as to the contents of any of the court pleadings.  So its inconclusive."

You can find all the Nevada, and other election lawsuits, including all the filings here: https://www.democracydocket.com/state/nevada.&nbs p; Let us know if you find one in which the affidavit was submitted; I don't see it.  
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Marc Baptiste
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Joined: 17 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3655
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 8:52am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Peter,

Geoff and other Trumpers like him don't need audits when their candidate wins.

Marc
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 14811
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 8:58am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

It needs to be done for the welfare of the American voters, so they can be assured the system did not fail them.

-----

The system already fails. As a suburban voter in California, I've never waited more than 10 minutes to cast a vote. Meanwhile, there were voters in Georgia who were in line for more than 8 hours. I had multiple locations to drop off my mail-in ballot. In Texas, they limited drop-off locations to one per county, which means places like Harris County, which contains Houston and is noncoincidentally Democratic, had one drop-off location for 4.7 million people.

You know what needs to be done for the welfare of the American voters? Making it easier for them to vote. The Sturm und Drang over voter fraud is meant to do the opposite of that. Dozens or even hundreds instances of voter fraud are unlikely to alter an election, but disenfranchising tens of thousands of voters will.

The Georgia Secretary of State even implied that Trump's sowing of distrust of mail-in ballots might have cost him Georgia, as there were 24,000 Republicans who voted absentee in the primary who didn't vote in the general election.
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Michael Casselman
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 14 January 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1210
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 9:58am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Whether its drop-off locations or actual in-person voting facilities, metropolitan areas really need to get on the stick. There should be equal and accessible voting locations for every X-amount of the local population. These hours-long waits to vote are inexcusable.
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James Woodcock
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Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7581
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 10:30am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Michael - that's the sensible way of doing things - pretty
sure that's what we do in the UK as I have never, in over
30 years of voting, had to queue to cast a vote. And I have
moved about quite a bit

I actually can't believe that this is not the case
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Kevin Brown
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 31 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 8838
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 10:31am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

If instances of fraud are not fully and completely investigated - how can we ever trust the system?

*****************************

To reiterate:  THERE HAS BEEN NO FRAUD!!!!!  PERIOD.
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L Hunt
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 20 November 2020
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 159
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 12:27pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

James, think I queued at the last General Election...for about 3 minutes.
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John Wickett
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 12 July 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 795
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 5:47pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Brad,

Thanks for the link.  The case to watch is Law v. Whitmer.  If the affidavit is used, it will be in that case.  

Keep in mind the main document on file right now is just a Statement of Contest.  No evidence has been presented yet. The statement references evidence that we have not seen yet, including video files that have not yet been presented to the court.   

We won't have to wait long to see whether they use it, because the Defense has filed a Motion to Dismiss based on lack of evidence.  When the Plaintiff's file their Opposition to the Motion to Dismiss, it should include evidentiary exhibits, or at the very least, a list of evidence they intend to present.    
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James Woodcock
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7581
Posted: 24 November 2020 at 7:00pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Of course no evidence has been presented yet - because there is no
actual evidence.
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