| Author |
|
Matt Hawes
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 16658
|
| Posted: 08 June 2021 at 5:11pm | IP Logged | 1
|
post reply
|
|
Ron's story reminds me of when I had a big surprise ruined for me. Luckily, it was not the story of Guardian's death. My friend and his mother returned home from the movies, after having seen "Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back". As my younger brother and I ran up to them getting out of their car, my friend let out the big reveal about Darth Vader! EEP!
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 32054
|
| Posted: 08 June 2021 at 7:36pm | IP Logged | 2
|
post reply
|
|
AF 12 was the first back issue I ever searched for in the bins and
bought.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
David Schmidt
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 11 July 2017
Location: France
Posts: 441
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 3:24am | IP Logged | 3
|
post reply
|
|
Read it in french I had absolutely no idea of what was going to happen until last page lucky me.
In fact I'm not even sure french readers knew someone was supposed to die in this issue. Alpha Flight #12 was published in a book called "Strange" along with two issues of Spider-Man and one of Daredevil.
You can imagine how shocked we were...
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Darren Taylor
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 April 2004
Location: Scotland
Posts: 6076
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 3:43am | IP Logged | 4
|
post reply
|
|
I read AF #12 unaware of the outcome. In fact I was pretty solid on the fact that the one person who wouldn't die would be Guardian.
It was a real kick in the balls. So, nothing was spoiled for me, I was lucky...well as lucky as a dunt in the 'chaps' can be.
Excellent writing to lead the audience one way and then flaunt the upcoming outcome ("One must die") and yet still deliver a dramatic blow.
Still smarts by the way.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 136298
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 4:34am | IP Logged | 5
|
post reply
|
|
I still remember one furious letter from a female fan who read as far as Snowbird's distress and "threw the comic across the room". She was really angry that it was one of the ladies I was killing.I selected the letter for publication, with an "editorial" response of "Should have kept reading!" but it was cut for no adequately explained reason.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Conrad Teves
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 2287
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 11:37am | IP Logged | 6
|
post reply
|
|
It's remarkable how some can't take the long view with fiction. They have the profound luxury of caring about things that didn't happen to people who don't exist and reacting strongly to it. You know what that makes you? Entertained.There is real power in fiction, and you can learn a lot about yourself by how you react, but some take it too hard. I know some who quit Game of Thrones because of how something turned out bad for a character they liked, and some who did the whole Ugly Crying thing during the Red Wedding and came back for more.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Rebecca Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018
Location: Canada
Posts: 4559
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 12:01pm | IP Logged | 7
|
post reply
|
|
I picked Alpha Flight #23 to retire on as a reader... I was dropping a lot of regular titles at the time, I was getting really down on mainstream Marvel and DC at the time, especially cross-overs that seemed forced just to boosts sales. There were some deaths I thought were done for that same sole reason, and that even when a character died 'well' they would exhume the corpse for further excessive marketing (Phoenix and Elektra) retroactively ruining the original experience that had worked. If I had been around for Snowbird's demise it would've just seemed one of a parade of female characters being killed and I might well have had a negative reaction, her dead body and any blurb saying buy this historic event comics would've made it worse.
Storm had become a punk vampire, Kitty a ninja, Ms. was Marvel raped and her powers stolen by the dialect spewing Rogue then turned into a second-banana Starjammer, Batgirl put in a wheelchair no longer Batgirl, Wasp a battered wife, PhoenixII/Rachel seemed to get dispatched by Wolverine in the last X comic I bought, and the list of recently dead heroines included some very major names... stars of their own titles I had followed like Spider-Woman (Jessica Drew), and Supergirl, who had been aimless for years outside the Legion and might as well have been discontinued, but her dead body on covers made it seem another I cared about thrown away mainly for a brief publicity/sales spike. I understand there's superheroines tortured and killed porn out there... some people possibly including some in charge had some kind of problem if you ask me. 'Nuff said. I believe female readers disappeared in droves in the '80s for Marvel and DC, and letters with female names in the letters pages got rarer I expect. If they'd killed The Falcon, Cyborg, Luke Cage/Power Man and Black Lightning, plus crippled the Black Panther in the space of a few years I think black readership would've fallen. But none did have that happen. How many major white male superheroes died in the '80s? One of the Robins and Captain Marvel/Mar-Vell are the only ones I come up with (Batman Earth 2 and Mr. Terrific in the late '70s hardly being at all major). That they 'killed' Superman was taking the publicity sales chasing thing to it's limit and of course he came back in multiple forms right away. Yes, Guardian/Vindicator was killed for awhile; I remember some male fans protesting in fanzines, and conventions around here, about it... Guardian's Guardians one bunch called themselves. There had been angry readers on behalf of Phoenix before that.
Snowbird was killed and a female reader was not happy, but perhaps like me she had the weight of a lot of other characters taken away shortly before and around the same time? I know things have to happen in stories and to characters one cares about... but it was happening depressingly a lot then, even if sometimes 'well done'. That said, She Hulk in FF and Jean Grey returning were two very bright spots in what has been called a 'dark' age of superhero comics. Sorry for being overly verbose as usual for me. Thanks for anyone reading this and being able to share here!
I am a forced early retiree in some areas mainly due to health issues, though some economic issues are involved too, and it is not my choice.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 136298
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 12:41pm | IP Logged | 8
|
post reply
|
|
sigh
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Rebecca Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018
Location: Canada
Posts: 4559
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 1:01pm | IP Logged | 9
|
post reply
|
|
Where did they go? Actually I do remember when I was a spinner rack stalker in that first flush of fan-ness wondering where Jack Kirby had gone, there had been quite a bunch of comics and many covers by him up to the late '70s and then he did seem to stop quite suddenly... but then I found the comic book specialist shop and Captain Victory.
I just remembered the Flash was killed of course, same place as Supergirl. They did only have to upgrade Kid Flash though to keep the 'property' going with barely a speed bump.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Peter Martin
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 16460
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 1:01pm | IP Logged | 10
|
post reply
|
|
Rebecca wrote:
| Snowbird was killed and a female reader was not happy |
|
|
She didn't die on JB's watch. The female reader JB referred to - -the one who wrote in -- incorrectly assumed Snowbird was the one who dies in AF #12 (only reading to the bit where Diamond Lil cuts her with an indestructible hair). Of course, it was not Snowbird who died in that issue or in any of JB's 28 issues.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Rebecca Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018
Location: Canada
Posts: 4559
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 1:04pm | IP Logged | 11
|
post reply
|
|
Ah, thanks Peter, I didn't get that part!
I wish I'd kept some of the fanzines around that had the stuff by and about Guardian's Guardians 'protesting' and wearing armbands over Alpha Flight #12... I think their main issue was that there were not enough Canadian heroes to lose one, but I'm trying to think of any Canadian heroes who had been killed before that. Oh, I also remember a reaction about fishermen protesting if it had've been Marina. That kind of put it in perspective for me. :^D
Edited by Rebecca Jansen on 09 June 2021 at 1:09pm
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Peter Martin
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2008
Location: Canada
Posts: 16460
|
| Posted: 09 June 2021 at 1:10pm | IP Logged | 12
|
post reply
|
|
Re: sigh. If it's any consolation, judging by the comments, people do know about Elsewhen. Just not the guy who made the video...
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |