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Tim O Neill
Byrne Robotics Security

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10614
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 1:08pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

George Floyd was 46 years old when he died. He was too young to die, and it
would be tragic for his family and friends if it was something like a car accident
or illness. He certainly didn't deserve to die in the street, held down by four
men, gasping for air.

I agree with the protests, but I can't agree with violence as a solution. How
can the United States confront racism?

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Ronald Joseph
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 18 April 2011
Location: United States
Posts: 1784
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 1:18pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

I agree with the protests, but I can't agree with violence as a solution. How can the United States confront racism?

Maybe the violence is exactly what we need to finally open some eyes. It's definitely what some deserve, IMHO.

We had a chance to address it amicably very recently, but instead of opening up a dialogue, it became fashionable for many to call peaceful protesters like Colin Kapernick "Sons of Bitches." 

I don't see us closing this wound any time soon. In fact, I see it only getting worse. 
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Shaun Barry
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Joined: 08 December 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 6742
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 1:21pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

We may not agree with or condone the violence and riots that have come with the protests, but a blind man could see that people are also FED UP.

Sadly, I'm not sure there is a solution.  Not when it's been an issue within the U.S. since the very beginning of its inception as a country.

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Rick Senger
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8992
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 1:30pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Get a commander-in-chief whose first response isn't calling protestors thugs and calling for an armed response against Americans by saying "These THUGS are dishonoring the memory of George Floyd, and I won't let that happen. Just spoke to Governor Tim Walz and told him that the Military is with him all the way. Any difficulty and we will assume control but, when the looting starts, the shooting starts. Thank you!"   Trump's later walk back was predictably disingenuous.
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Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 31 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 4570
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 1:57pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

I am entirely in support of peaceful protests. I am completely opposed to dirty cops. But when it comes kto violent protests, I am against setting things on fire and using pepper spray against non-violent protesters and looting and shooting and excessive action on both sides. Looting isn't a protest; it's a crime, and the perpetrators should be arrested.

Then we get those who say they were only protesting the crime - George Floyd in this case. And they say that the police are exceeding their authority. And of course, there are those - say the store owners - whose businesses have been vandalized, and who are rooting for those who did it to be arrested.

It's not simple; it's NEVER simple. And violence leads to violence. But damn it, people who are screwing up peaceful protests really piss me off.
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Paul Kimball
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 21 September 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1976
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 2:04pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

At least we have a leader who's good at bringing people together, who doesn't
look for conflict and won't say things to glorify and encourage further
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 13759
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 2:15pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

I think Kareem Abdul-Jabbar expresses what Iím feeling better than I could. (Sorry if behind a paywall.) tand-the-protests-what-youre-seeing-is-people-pushed-to-the- edge

I donít condone violence and feel for those whose businesses and livelihoods are being affected by the protests. But Iím not going to judge those fed up by the continuing institutional racism that makes them fearful for their lives. This is not just about George Floyd. 
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 13759
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 2:24pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

I will say that there are anecdotal reports and video footage of white anarchists and possible white supremacist agent provocateurs (look up the video of the ďUmbrella ManĒ) instigating violence and property damage, and /those/ guys can go fuck themselves. 
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Michael Casselman
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 14 January 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1065
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 2:27pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

From what I've read, the cop who had his knee on Floyds neck knew him from a place they worked at together.
At this point, I couldn't say what was in the cops heart in terms of him being a racist, nor do I know much about the other 3 cops (at least one of which was a POC) who also held Floyd down for about 8 minutes.
I think it's simplistic to view this simply as a racial issue. It's Race. It's Police Brutality. It's a systemic breakdown of basic decency. It's over 6 dozen cities nationwide either on fire this morning or under curfew or digging out from those who've chosen to take out their frustrations (or, as I fear, take advantage of the frustrations of others) by destroying not only banks and Starbucks in their neighborhood, but also destroying small businesses (including those female and minority owned) who are just now trying to recover from the COVID shutdown.
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Ron Grant
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 18 December 2016
Location: Canada
Posts: 193
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 6:10pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

To paraphrase Trevor Noah when they first
thought that firing the cop who Killed George
Floyd was an appropriate punishment they were
no longer serving or protecting the
community,the social contract that we all obey
was torn up. So what if they burned down the
police station or looted that target don't
matter the rules no longer apply or that cop
would have went to jail.People like to tell
the protestors how to protest they say things
like they shouldn't loot,they shouldn't
vandalize and they shouldn't resort to
violence. thing is you don't get to make rules
for people for whom the rules always seem to
get broken.They tried to tell the people in
South Africa how to protest,They told MLK how
to protest and they told the people of
Ferguson Missouri how to protest.

Edited by Ron Grant on 31 May 2020 at 6:24pm
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Rebecca Jansen
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 12 February 2018
Location: Canada
Posts: 2632
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 10:14pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

It's so easy for the tiny number of extreme people to destroy trust. I think it's true for both 'sides' in this situation. The old two wrongs never make a right. The vast number of police officers, and the vast number of black citizens, are trustworthy, human, sane. It takes a long time to build trust and I hope it can be rebuilt, but they have really got to find a way to screen out the people who should never be in certain positions and direct them to something else! That main kneeling idiot officer had a long history of complaints, and so few ever result in any action at all, like 1-2%! It's also apparently almost impossible to convict a police officer or even a former police officer on anything, and that is totally wrong. Regulation is necessary, we prove this to ourselves over and over, and they have to have teeth. It's way too costly to throw out oversight in a pretense of a discrimination problem no longer existing (look how fast we have discovered the U.S. voter's rights act was very much still necessary).

I watched areas of Seattle I used to walk often smashed up last night. I'm not watching as much tonight, there's not that much to understand. People allow themselves to cross a line, others don't stop them, and then they do it again, and then someone else does it in self-justified reaction, and eventually they feed on each other and the inch taken has gotten them several feet over the line, and it is so hard to change that momentum of blaming the other and to pull back never mind actually communicating. Once the cheese has slipped entirely off the cracker you might be able to put it back on, even straighten it up, but you will always know where that cheese had been and it's never the same. :^(
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Bill Collins
Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 26 May 2005
Location: England
Posts: 11006
Posted: 31 May 2020 at 11:33pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

We have had similar things in the U.K. over the last 30
years(Google Clinton McCurbin), the last being 2011, all
ended up with city centre riots and looting. The
destruction of blameless people`s livelihoods is not the
answer. I have no answer, but maybe some respected black
celebs/musicians could ask for non-violent protests?
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