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Rebecca Jansen Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018 Location: Canada Posts: 4635
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Posted: 31 March 2021 at 9:12pm | IP Logged | 1
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"Why some of my best friends were mutants." :^/
I really don't think Secret Wars stands up to this level of introspection or assumed verisimilitude with reality. Not having read beyond SW I #1 however I don't really know if the grouping together of mutants even made story sense.
I thought it was interesting the bit where Shooter recounts reconnecting to comics during a stay in the hospital (although he slams the DC comics on the ward as unread while the Marvels were heavily read). So many people with attachments to comic books had times of illness or isolation to thank for that, I know I did! What great paper company some imaginative comics can be. Of course now there are tablets and iphones and tvs in every room, so I suppose that purpose is probably much less likely now. I wonder how many people who went into radio had some situation where it was a major or sole source of entertainment and company for them?
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Rodrigo castellanos Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 03 July 2012 Location: Uruguay Posts: 1514
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Posted: 31 March 2021 at 11:30pm | IP Logged | 2
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At least Wolverine seems in character.
And channeling Nixon's attributed quote on Somoza: "He may be a son of a bitch, but he's our son of a bitch"
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Adam Schulman Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 July 2017 Posts: 1717
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 7:48am | IP Logged | 3
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Does Shooter discuss his writing of what one writer accurately called "The Rape of Ms. Marvel" in AVENGERS #200? If so, does he try to justify it?
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Eric Sofer Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 January 2014 Location: United States Posts: 4789
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 8:42am | IP Logged | 4
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Avengers #200 was a tough book. The lead up was pretty obviously a set up of some type, and had someone else come to the Avengers for help - "I've been raped or something, and three days later - I'M ABOUT TO GIVE BIRTH!"
But with Ms. Marvel, it was, "Aw, how sweet." Carol herself didn't object... and then, no one knew what to make of it. And THEN it was adulterated by Chris Claremont's story in Avengers Annual #10. I swear, averaging out those two pieces of dreck might generate a good story... but as is, Claremont tainted an already bad story. So... what the hell?
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 31161
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 9:07am | IP Logged | 5
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...”The Rape of Ms. Marvel" in AVENGERS #200? If so, does he try to justify it?
******
I thought Michelinie wrote that one.
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 31161
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 9:15am | IP Logged | 6
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I haven’t gotten to listen to any more yet, but an almost constant theme with him (and one I’ve read/heard him use in other interviews) is how he’s always ended up writing books either because a) no one else wanted the book, or b) he was afraid if he gave the book to someone, then other people would be pissed. In the case of a, I find it hard to believe no one else would want to write THE AVENGERS or DAREDEVIL. DAZZLER, sure, and maybe even GHOST RIDER, but not the others. And for b, I guess that seems a bit more plausible, but would Chris Claremont really be mad if Bill Mantlo or Denny O’Neil wrote SECRET WARS? Would John Byrne be pissed if Walt Simonson or Frank Miller or even Chris Claremont wrote it?
His excuses for things like this are tiresome. Just come out and say, “hey, I wanted to write it.” and be done with it.
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Peter Martin Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 15939
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 10:55am | IP Logged | 7
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Brian Miller wrote:
I thought Michelinie wrote that one. |
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That issue is credited to Michelinie for the script and Shooter, Layton, Perez and Michelinie for the plot.
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 31161
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 11:43am | IP Logged | 8
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Ah. Thanks, Peter.
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Peter Martin Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 15939
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 1:20pm | IP Logged | 9
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You're welcome. Still can't work out how they managed to do an interview that was nearly 8 hours long! I'm about 45 mins in and have skimmed some just to get there...
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Dave Phelps Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 4184
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 3:14pm | IP Logged | 10
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Brian Miller wrote:
I haven’t gotten to listen to any more yet, but an almost constant theme with him (and one I’ve read/heard him use in other interviews) is how he’s always ended up writing books either because a) no one else wanted the book, or b) he was afraid if he gave the book to someone, then other people would be pissed. In the case of a, I find it hard to believe no one else would want to write THE AVENGERS or DAREDEVIL. DAZZLER, sure, and maybe even GHOST RIDER, but not the others. |
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Keep in mind "no one" means "no one currently working for Marvel who has a hole in their schedule when we need to get the next issue out," which isn't that hard to imagine. As for the two you listed, until Miller came around, Daredevil was the book that writers would pick up, not really know what to do with, and then drop like a rock as soon as something better opened up or when they thought their schedule was too full. Avengers can be challenging for writers because you have 6+ main characters, some of who have their own books you'd need to keep up with.
(In the interests of full disclosure, I'll admit that I liked his Daredevil run, his first Avengers run and most of his second Avengers run (although #213 dug a hole I don't think he quite managed to climb out of before leaving).)
QUOTE:
And for b, I guess that seems a bit more plausible, but would Chris Claremont really be mad if Bill Mantlo or Denny O’Neil wrote SECRET WARS? Would John Byrne be pissed if Walt Simonson or Frank Miller or even Chris Claremont wrote it? |
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A 12 issue story with 19+ main characters fighting a bunch of villains in an isolated habitat where you couldn't really do anything with them (and what little you could would've been spoiled before the second issue was out), all the while having to deal with inputs from a toy company? Plus you'd probably have to drop one of your extant books to have time in your schedule to write it. I'd put that one in category a) as much as (if not more than) b). But assuming it does fall under the latter, it seems like most writers take a proprietary interest over their characters while they're holding the baton. If it was me, I'd probably have an easier time of it if the boss was the one to "borrow" them rather than a peer.
Not necessarily saying you're wrong about his motivations, but his version of events is certainly plausible.
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 31161
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 4:12pm | IP Logged | 11
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He just started talking about JB. Thank god he didn’t listen to LenMarv and gave that Byrne kid a shot.
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Brian Miller Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004 Location: United States Posts: 31161
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Posted: 01 April 2021 at 4:19pm | IP Logged | 12
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And his recollection of Dark Phoenix is quite different than that told by our host.
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