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Brian ONeill
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 04 July 2024
Posts: 54
Posted: 22 July 2024 at 9:41pm | IP Logged | 1  

If Harris finished Biden's term, and then got elected, she could still run in 2028.
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6550
Posted: 22 July 2024 at 10:06pm | IP Logged | 2  

The incumbent advantage is one of Lichtman’s “keys” to winning elections.

Harris doesn’t have it unless Biden gives it to her. He has given a lot
already, but to win this I would sure ask him to give this amount also.
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Jason Czeskleba
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 30 April 2004
Posts: 4649
Posted: 22 July 2024 at 10:31pm | IP Logged | 3  

Brian is correct.  The 22nd Amendment says that someone who has already served more than two years of another President's term can only be elected President once.  But if they've served exactly two years or less, they can be elected twice.  So Harris taking over as President now would not preclude her being elected President twice.  The 22nd Amendment allows a person to serve as President for a maximum of 10 year under the right circumstances, although no one has exceeded 8 years since its passage.  For example, if Johnson had run for re-election in 1968 and won, he would have wound up serving for 9 years and two months.

Biden stepping down now would just create chaos.  There would likely be no Vice President for the next six months, which wouldn't be good at a time when the hypothetical President Harris would be preoccupied with running her campaign.  Lichtman's keys to winning the election aren't some magic formula, they are simply observations about how things have gone in the most recent years. 


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John Wickett
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Joined: 12 July 2016
Location: United States
Posts: 875
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 12:37am | IP Logged | 4  

"Several Republicans are calling on Biden to resign now...I do not understand the strategy there."

Maybe its not a strategy.  Maybe they genuinely believe Biden is no longer capable of doing the job, and they want someone to step in who is.

But if it is strategic, there are two narratives I've heard:

1. If Biden resigns or is removed via the 25th Amendment, it proves the reality of his cognitive decline, and it means his administration, including Harris, has been lying to the American people about Biden's fitness to be in office.

or 

2.  Harris will not be a good President, and having Biden resign now will give her almost four months to display her inability to voters.

Hard to say whether Biden resigning would be politically good or bad for either political party or Trump at this point.  Conventional wisdom would have suggested the criminal convictions would be bad for Trump, but they seem to have solidified his support.  We are in uncharted waters here.  

Setting aside what is good or bad for the parties, I think this entire fiasco has been bad for the country, and will continue to be until after the election.  There has always been corruption in government, but increasingly, it appears that the leaders of the parties, and many of those who hold national offices are more concerned with maintaining power than serving the country.

Ben Franklin, speaking at the 1787 Constitutional Convention on the dangers of a salaried bureaucracy: "There are two passions which have a powerful influence on the affairs of men...ambition and avarice; the love of power and the love of money...Place before the eyes of such men a post of honor that shall be at the same time a place of profit, and they will move heaven and earth to obtain it...and what kind are the men that will strive for this profitable pre-eminence, through all the bustle of cabal, the infinite mutual abuse of parties, tearing to pieces the best of characters? It will not be the wise and moderate; the lovers of peace and good order, the men fittest for the trust. It will be the bold and the violent, the men of strong passions and indefatigable activity in their selfish pursuits. These will thrust themselves into your government and be your rulers...their vanquished competitors of the same spirit, and from the same motives, will perpetually be endeavoring to distress their administration, thwart their measures and render them odious to the people."

That sure describes where we are now, and where we've been for too long. Worse, the destructive mentality that Franklin foresaw in our political leaders has infiltrated the populace, so that we are more bitterly divided than at almost any other point in our history. I just hope there is some way to start turning that around without a 9-11 scale tragedy.


Edited by John Wickett on 23 July 2024 at 12:39am
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Jason Czeskleba
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 30 April 2004
Posts: 4649
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 3:09am | IP Logged | 5  

 John Wickett wrote:
Setting aside what is good or bad for the parties, I think this entire fiasco has been bad for the country, and will continue to be until after the election.
If by "entire fiasco" you mean Donald Trump's political career, then I agree with you.  And it's going to continue to be a problem as long as Trump's political career continues.  Trump did not create the divisions in this country, but he most certainly poured gasoline on them and lit the match, and he's the person far more responsible than anyone else for keeping them going.  There is no way to turn this around while Trump is out there telling some Americans that other Americans are their dire enemies, actively seeking to pit people against each other for his own benefit.  If Trump wins, then "after the election" will not be the end point, but just the beginning.

And no, I do not think Trump's political retirement would solve everything.  But I do know that zero progress will be made in healing our national divisions while he is in power, because he does not want it and will not allow it.

I'm quite sure the Republicans calling for Biden to resign do not sincerely believe he is incapable of doing the job.  Particularly Mike Johnson, who has worked closely with him. They are cynically advancing a politically-motivated narrative.  Nothing more. 

   


Edited by Jason Czeskleba on 23 July 2024 at 3:10am
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6550
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 4:19am | IP Logged | 6  

JW : “ There has always been corruption in government, but increasingly, it
appears that the leaders of the parties, and many of those who hold
national offices are more concerned with maintaining power than serving
the country.”



This is written in reaction to the selfless act of a U.S. President stepping
aside in hopes of assisting a broader coalition of voters to join forces
against the re-election of a twice-impeached adjudicated rapist and
convicted felon who tried to overturn an election and announced his intent
to be a “dictator on day one.”

Make it make sense.
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James Woodcock
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7883
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 6:57am | IP Logged | 7  

I cannot believe how much my Twatter feed is full of people posting that
Biden is dead.

This is what Musk feels the platform should be? Really?
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Jim Burdo
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 19 April 2020
Location: United States
Posts: 377
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 9:34am | IP Logged | 8  

This Should Help: One W. Brown From San Fran Says Make Kamala President Now

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John Byrne

Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133696
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 10:56am | IP Logged | 9  

I already said that.
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Michael Casselman
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 14 January 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1257
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 1:00pm | IP Logged | 10  

This is written in reaction to the selfless act of a U.S. President stepping aside in hopes of assisting a broader coalition of voters to join forces against the re-election of a twice-impeached adjudicated rapist and convicted felon who tried to overturn an election and announced his intent to be a “dictator on day one.”
---------------------------------------------------------

I wonder what was the final straw.

Yes, it was a selfless act, but would it have happened if not for that disasterous eternity between "mumble-mumble" and "We beat Medicaid"? Would it have happened if not for donors withholding money? Would he have realized his own shortcomings had the Clooneys, the Pelosis, the Schumers, the entire squad of Democratic backers, politicians, movers and shakers not been so public with their concerns? Was it his bout with COVID?

The Democratic primaries weren't that long ago that whatever doubts they had/have about his ability to run couldn't have existed then, when there was an opportunity to give primary voters a choice to pick another more energetic, viable candidate. They were simultaneously propping him up ("I'm With Joe") while nudging him to take himself out.

I'd be curious to know who (outside of his family) was involved in those final conversations before that memo came out... because on one day he was scrappy, swinging for the fences, itchin' for a fight.... and the next, he says he's out of the race. That's a huge about-face over a weekend.

This seems like an eternity that this has been taking place, but it hasn't even been a month yet since the debate. And these last 10 days....

The last week-and-a-half has been such a rollercoaster that I'm not sure what anyone could come up with for an October Surprise. We've already done a cover-all on the current Bingo card and we're not even at the end of July.
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Kevin Brown
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 31 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9031
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 1:24pm | IP Logged | 11  

If Biden resigns or is removed via the 25th Amendment, it proves the reality of his cognitive decline, and it means his administration, including Harris, has been lying to the American people about Biden's fitness to be in office.

**********************************
That proves nothing.  IMO, I suspect his bout with Covid is what drove this.  His cognitive abilities are not in decline, especially nowhere near what the orange one's are!  
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Casey Sager
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 750
Posted: 23 July 2024 at 2:45pm | IP Logged | 12  

It was the donor money drying up as well as several large donors who said they were holding money back in general until he stepped down.
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