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Petter Myhr Ness
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 02 July 2009
Location: Norway
Posts: 4016
Posted: 23 September 2023 at 5:48pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

The selfish gene - knowing you hated the experience, but still being grateful you did Superman...

So many creators have name-dropped your Superman, while at the same time making radical (and often ridiculous) changes to the character, showing they learnt nothing from the work they were praising. But for a while there, at least until the Death of Superman, things were pretty good for a Superman fan. 


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Paul Gibney
Byrne Robotics Member.


Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 1086
Posted: 23 September 2023 at 7:54pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Superman is not really vulnerable to Magic, he's just not
Invulnerable to magic.
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James Woodcock
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 8091
Posted: 23 September 2023 at 9:12pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Very few times have I read/enjoyed/been drawn to Superman except JB’s
stories.
He understood how to do him justice, without having to bring cynicism into
the mix.
I think the only other time I enjoyed him was when Gary Frank was drawing
him, but that really an art thing as I love Frank’s art so much.
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Rich Marzullo
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Joined: 13 January 2011
Location: United States
Posts: 2830
Posted: 24 September 2023 at 12:09am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

JB, your Superman run had such a positive impact on me and millions of others. I truly hope you have solace in that (not to take away from your negative experiences though). 
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Steven Myers
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Joined: 10 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5727
Posted: 24 September 2023 at 12:34am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Stern/Byrne's abrupt departure in Captain America is still the most disappointed I've ever been concerning a comic. I have nothing but praise for the stories they did on that run. Amazing stuff!

I was never a Superman fan. I only recently read all the Byrne (and Wolfman and Ordway) Superman comics. It's...just okay. Whereas I totally love Perez's Wonder Woman reboot! That was magical!

Jean Grey died the issue before I started reading X-Men. When I finally read 137, I thought her death seemed odd. Odder still is how many times she and other X-Men have died since.

And as a footnote, Secret Wars was awful. I think it was a real blow to the Marvel Universe. Before SW things happened much more organically. Afterwards changes seemed forced.
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Rod Collins
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Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 941
Posted: 24 September 2023 at 2:09am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

…if I had a working time machine and could go back and whisper in my ear.

• When Shooter’s Whim of Iron demanded that all stories be single issues, Roger Stern and I were caught several pages into what we planned as a three issue story in CAPTAIN AMERICA. Very reasonably we told Shooter we would be happy to start doing single issue stories as soon as we finished that story—which we offered to compress into two issues. But Shooter insisted the single issue stories would start immediately, with whatever issues were currently in the works. Roger quit in protest (plus some other reasons of which I was unaware at the time). Jim Salicrup, the editor, offered me the writing job, but I felt I had to support Rog, so I left, too.

If I had known then what I know now, I would have convinced Rog to stay, we would have set aside the finished pages, and done a few single issue stories until the Whim blew over, as it invariably did.

• Another (infamous) example of the Whim of Iron, when Shooter saw what Chris Claremont and I had done in X-MEN 137, he claimed to have had no idea what we were planning and ordered our story changed. Jean Grey, for her crimes, was to be “taken to a prison asteroid to be horribly tortured for all eternity.”

That sounded to me like an incredibly misogynistic Legion of Superheroes story, prompting me to utter the immortal words “F**k that, I’d rather kill her.” *

Looking back, I wish Chris and I had just done what Shooter ordered, and a few issues later had the X-Men rescue Jean.

• And now the biggie. When Dick Giordano called to offer me Superman, I wish I’d said no.

There are some who don’t believe this, but it’s true. The Superman experience was one of the most unpleasant of my career—and it continues, as people at DC continue to find ways to chip away at what little is left of what I did.

*****

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

The book that I remember the single-issue story decree affecting the most was Master Of Kung Fu. It seemed built for multi-issue epics that moved the characters forward. When it went to single-issue stories the energy and momentum just dissipated.  It became a book without a purpose. 

Given what you've said about the way things were going with yours and Chris Claremont's working relationship, I wonder if you would have lasted any longer on X-Men anyway.

Superman was an amazing accomplishment considering all that was happening behind the scenes. Including mini-series and annuals you managed to put out over 50 issues in a two-year period and make a 50-year-old character seem fresh and relatable. That's pretty amazing in itself. Your Action Comics run and the Legend mini-series also gave many of us Marvel fans an inroad into the DC Universe.

While I was saddened that you'd left the FF and the Hulk, there was a level of excitement that came with you being on Superman. It felt like the beginning of something new and exciting, particularly with Perez on Wonder Woman and Miller doing Year One. 

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Jim Petersman
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Joined: 26 June 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 668
Posted: 24 September 2023 at 5:18pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Hmmm. If JB had said no to Superman, would George Perez have been tapped for that project instead? Would the world have missed out on George's Wonder Woman?
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James Woodcock
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 8091
Posted: 24 September 2023 at 10:00pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

What gets me is that Perez had just as bad an experience with Superman as
did JB.
The two top writer/artists, totally kicked from pillar to post on the same
character.
What a waste
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Sheila Friedland
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 11 July 2022
Location: United States
Posts: 57
Posted: 25 September 2023 at 11:54pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

So I re-read the FAQ section, and here’s the summary of whyJB disliked his time on Superman from my reading:

-Marv Wolfman sort of screwed him on Luthor

-He wasn’t given space to show Superman “learning the ropes”and do the totally hard reboot that was promised.  (IMO, “Man of Steel” was the hardest reboot I’veever seen.  But that’s IMO)

-DC ignored his concerns about the effect on the Legion

So simply because I’m interested I’d like to respectfully ask:

- is it true that DC would not feature Mr. Byrne’s art onmerchandise and stuck with Garcia-Lopez? If so, then why?  The ByrneSuperman is classic and recognizable!

 

-was making action comics a weekly something that botheredyou?  Why did they do that?

-Wouldn’t you say it’s impossible for DC to havekept “your” Superman nearly 40 years on? 
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Jim Petersman
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 26 June 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 668
Posted: 26 September 2023 at 12:56am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

I'm not sure that you read that correctly, Sheila.
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6867
Posted: 26 September 2023 at 6:23am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

If the Superman on merchandise is a totally different character than the one
in the comics, then which one’s real?

One of them is “just fan fic”— and that’s not what the job was advertised as.
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Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 31542
Posted: 26 September 2023 at 1:22pm | IP Logged | 12 post reply

JB, did you have any way in who your inkers would be? How’d Giordano,
Terry (tied with TLGS as my favorite collaboration between you two) and
Kesel get involved with the projects?
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