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Brian Floyd
Byrne Robotics Member


Joined: 07 July 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 8778
Posted: 08 April 2025 at 8:18pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

If Trump had read about the tariff in U.S. history and actually cared, he wouldn't have used them. Tariffs are one of the things that caused The Great Depression!

As for how Russia profits? They're sitting back laughing as Trump destorys our economy and our reputation. And if its ever proven without a shadow of a doubt that Trump is a Russian asset, there will be hell to pay.






Edited by Brian Floyd on 08 April 2025 at 8:19pm
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Brennan Voboril
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Joined: 15 January 2011
Posts: 1810
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 12:26am | IP Logged | 2 post reply

The Russia bits are conspiracy theories.  Trump a Russian asset?  Please.  The tariff stuff?  Just get a book on how Hamilton paid our war debt with tariffs.  Or, how Abe Lincoln used them.   They have been used to great success in our history.  I don’t believe Trump will have success with them but that doesn’t mean they have not been used successfully. 
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Brian Floyd
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Joined: 07 July 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 8778
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 12:52am | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Trump may or may not be a Russian asset, but the fact is the Russians are sitting back enjoying what is going on. 

Russia fears NATO. Trump is risking possible war with NATO - not just Denmark - over the Greeland bullshit. Trump is badmouthing and abandoning Ukraine. And he has shown far too much tolerance of Putin. That all feeds into the `Russian asset' theory.

Tariffs DO NOT work when you import more things from the countries affected than you export to them. I've seen far too many MAGA idiots who keep saying `tariffs are a tax on those countries' because they don't realize the costs are passed on to the consumer. These fools will blaming anyone other than Trump when prices go up. 




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Mark Haslett
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Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6765
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 1:20am | IP Logged | 4 post reply

Trump tariffs hit penguins harder than they hit Russia or its vassal state,
Belarus.

Again, if Putin himself was President, nothing would be different. The
dismantling of what exists of American greatness is happening at a rate no
foreign agent could hope to achieve.
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Conrad Teves
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Joined: 28 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 2282
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 1:59am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Brennan >> Just get a book on how Hamilton paid our war debt with tariffs.<<


Trump just slapped 105% on China.  Even Elon is starting to get lippy about Peter Navarro. He can see through the Ketamine well enough still to know that such indiscriminate application is stupid enough that it's hard to find an economist not named "Ron Vera" who approves. 

Workers at the FoxConn plant in ShenZhen earn less than $3/hr.  Boring and soul-crushing enough they had to put up suicide nets, but also the best job they ever had, too. They can send money home.  China is still an emerging economy with a large fraction living like they did 2000 years ago.
Try building iPhones in America with the sort of wages and workweek we demand.  According to Forbes, $30000 per phone in vastly smaller volume.

Tariffs can be a useful economic tool when deftly applied (to protect domestic industries), but what happens when the tariffed product is not made here at all or would be cheaper than what we can do even with the tariff?  All you'll do is slow down your economy. In this case, globally.

Personally, considering what I just spent on an iPhone a couple months ago, I'd just as soon them tack on $100 per phone so the workers don't want to die.

(Edited to fix typo)


Edited by Conrad Teves on 09 April 2025 at 2:07am
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Mark Haslett
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Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6765
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 2:24am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Tariffs before the Great Depression drove a third of our work force out of
work. Do you know what would happen if 1/3 of America lost its job today?

Tariffs have broken the greatest alliance of nations in the world and set
China on a course of wealth they could only have dreamed of. Russia thrives
on undermining democracies as they have in Venezuela, Syria, and Turkey.
To have toppled America from its unprecedented position of favor and
wealth at the top of the globalist pyramid is an unbelievable achievement—

But it’s all “self inflicted” because no one could ever have persuaded Trump
to do this for our new allies — it all came from Trump’s being so gosh
darned dumb. His last 30 years of dependence on Russia has nothing to do
with it.
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Brennan Voboril
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Joined: 15 January 2011
Posts: 1810
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 2:47am | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Conrad you must have missed the fact that I am not a Trump supporter.  We were talking about tariffs.  Hamilton used them successfully.  So did other presidents.  

It’s funny when every new thing comes along suddenly everyone is an expert in it.  Russia.  Tariffs.  Economics. 
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Conrad Teves
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Joined: 28 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 2282
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 3:02am | IP Logged | 8 post reply

Believe it or not, Brennan.  I do read books.  "Educated" does not mean expert in all fields.  And there is nothing at all new about economics.

>> I am not a Trump supporter. <<

No, I got that. What do you support?  
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Brennan Voboril
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Joined: 15 January 2011
Posts: 1810
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 3:40am | IP Logged | 9 post reply

What do I support re: what?  Odd question, but I’ll have a go at it: honesty in history.


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Conrad Teves
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Joined: 28 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 2282
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 4:15am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

I thought the context seemed clear, but okay.

As for "honesty in history," do you agree that Hamilton's tariffs were a tax on Americans? That he found the money for the war by taxing Americans?  Of course, they had to pay for it somehow, and the tools at their discretion were limited, but still a tax on Americans.

You understand that Trump thinks tariffs are paid by the exporting country, right?  Counselor to the President Peter Navarro was just on TV the other day saying tariffs were a tax *cut*, and was still pushing the "foreigners" pay nonsense.  This is the heart of all the obvious and inevitable opposition.  Their position (and actions) are founded on a clear falsehood. 
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James Woodcock
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Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 8054
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 8:42am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

When one considers that much of the information (such that it is) that the
orange one is using to drive his tariff arguments is actually trade deficit,
one has to wonder how it is possible to even attempt to justify supporting
what he is doing.
The cat is slowly coming out of the bag (although anyone paying attention
would have known this years ago, during his first term) - the real thing that
he is annoyed about is the trade deficit - other countries will not allow USA
cars and agriculture products into their country.

The reason is simple. Make cars that meet those countries’ safety
standards
Grow food in ways that meet those countries’ safety standards.

How hard to grasp is that?
He complains that the standards are designed to keep trade out.
Funny how other countries seem to be able to meet those standards.

As ever with the orange one, it’s all a smoke screen from the real point.
Because the real point has no legs.
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James Woodcock
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Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 8054
Posted: 09 April 2025 at 8:46am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

And whether he is a Russian agent is a moot point.
His actions, his comments, align more with Russia than with the USA’s
traditional allies.
His crowd of sycophants support Russia more than the USA’s traditional
allies.

Remember that puff piece by the former Fox presenter where he was
amazed that in Russia you have to use a token to use a shopping trolley?
That’s the level they will stoop to in promoting Russia as a place more
advanced than the USA. Shopping trolly tokens.
You’ve never had it so good
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