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Tim O Neill
Byrne Robotics Security
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10926
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 2:55pm | IP Logged | 1
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I don' think there is any question Trump will go to prison. Even if he wins the
election, Republicans will have to respond to true crime if they wish to remain a
viable political party. They will likely prefer this scenario - Trump ekes out an
election win, but Republicans support a second impeachment and Pence
becomes president, completing his biblical ascent.
The ultimate punishment for Trump is that he will be imprisoned with some of
the worst people who supported him. They will love being locked up with him.
And I hope they love him every single night, over and over and over again.
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Marc Baptiste
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3655
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 3:10pm | IP Logged | 2
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Tim,
I disagree. If any President of the United States were ever going to spend a day in federal prison it would be Trump. HOWEVER, the president of a republic that is foolish enough to pattern its executive branch on European monarchy - complete with unlimited pardon power -including the power to SELF-PARDON - is never going to see the inside of a jail cell.
Marc
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Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 4789
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 3:25pm | IP Logged | 3
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Well, the build up to the debate has started. By that I mean that I just saw on Channel 3 News that lots of peaceful protesters are having their signs taken away from them. Because really, would it be a Trump rally without a violation of the First Amendment?
A lot of people are worried about riots in Cleveland tonight. And that's including, silly as it may sound, the New York Yankees are in town in the first round of the AL Wild Card. Cleveland's gonna get REAL weird tonight! Spare a good thought for us tonight, if you woulld.
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Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 4789
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 3:40pm | IP Logged | 4
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I will ask now the big question on everyone's lips tomorrow - how soon until President Murder starts a nuclear war to distract from the election? I wager, at any odds and any amount, that Trump will so embarrass himself tonight that his ratings will fall either further; and he will go super desperate to stay in office. After all, who (the moron wonders) would demand elections to, like, COUNT when this country is at war.
Oh, sure, we're at war right now anyhow - but throwing nukes will be INTERESTING. And it'll misdirect so much... it'll be yuge. So great... the best war ever. Just the best ever.
No, I'm not kidding. I'm not engaging in hyperbole. I mean that come October 9th (always a Friday night), 45 will enter the nuclear codes and launch, literally.
Think it can't happen? Consider a desperate despot who wants to be in charge and knows he can't win an election fairly.
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Kevin Brown
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 8843
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 4:40pm | IP Logged | 5
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If any President of the United States were ever going to spend a day in federal prison it would be Trump. HOWEVER, the president of a republic that is foolish enough to pattern its executive branch on European monarchy - complete with unlimited pardon power -including the power to SELF-PARDON - is never going to see the inside of a jail cell.
******************************
He's been impeached, he can never be pardoned.
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Marc Baptiste
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3655
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 4:59pm | IP Logged | 6
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Kevin,
Wrong.
Marc
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Eric Sofer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 January 2014
Location: United States
Posts: 4789
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 5:32pm | IP Logged | 7
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Kevin - I believe that 45 cannot be impeached again for the crimes of impeachment. But A) I don't think double jeopardy applies here ("Alex, I'll take American Scumbags for $750") and B) I don't recall that the self-pardon trick is going to work.
But the number of his crimes while NOT president are not ignorable, and - if not federal offenses - may have NOTHING to do with a presidential self-pardon.
He's got a LOT of reasons to want to stay president, that's for sure.
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Marc Baptiste
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3655
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 6:02pm | IP Logged | 8
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He can be impeached again as many times as the House of Representatives feels like it. Double jeopardy does not apply here as impeachment is a political indictment not a criminal indictment and conviction in the Senate would be a political conviction and removal from office a political sanction not a criminal sanction. For example, the US Constitution clearly provides for a President being subject to civil and criminal trial and penalties for the very same crimes s/he was impeached and convicted for - double jeopardy notwithstanding.
As for pardoning oneself - a President is only barred from self-pardoning in "cases of impeachment" - which has been interpreted to mean basically this: s/he cannot pardon him or herself from the crime(s) with which he or she is accused and being impeached and thus short-circuit (or END) the impeachment process in its tracks. After impeachment and if found NOT GUILTY (as Trump was) by the Senate - he is STILL President with all the powers of President at his command and pardon himself against all federal crimes committed or POSSIBLY committed until the cows come home.
Marc
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Brian Floyd
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 July 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 8355
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 6:52pm | IP Logged | 9
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He can be impeached again, but not for the crimes he's already been impeached for....unless he commits them again.
And him thinking he can pardon himself is a delusion his part. Oh, he can sign the papers....but they'll either be shredded or used as toilet paper. If the president could pardon himself, Nixon would probably have done it. Ford pardoned Nixon, not Nixon himself.
My hope (and its probably a pipe dream) is that if Trump is re-elected, the Democrats take control of the House. Because then at least Moscow Mitch will be shut down. (That happens, he better start writing a resignation letter.) As will Trump. ("You want to do what, `Mister President?'' Naahhh.....")
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Shaun Barry
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 December 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 6833
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 7:25pm | IP Logged | 10
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From tonight's debate:
Biden just got major brownie points from me for telling Trump, "Will you shut up, man??" on live TV... perhaps the ONLY person who has done so over the past 4 years.
Maybe it wasn't professional... but it felt damn good just to hear it!
Edited by Shaun Barry on 29 September 2020 at 7:26pm
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Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 30898
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 7:26pm | IP Logged | 11
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Jesus H Christ. What a fucking fiasco
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David Allen Perrin
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 April 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 3541
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| Posted: 29 September 2020 at 8:11pm | IP Logged | 12
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My skin is fucking crawling....
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